for those people especially of conventional you know um regulators and so on can you share with us I mean how have you been interacting with them. ฎspecially last year when there were several incidents happened to digital asset industry // yeah sure soin in Vietnam I can talk a little bit about it uh maybe I'll put some context around it and probably talk a little bit more of how we do a little bit more on the west and how that kind of comes into how Vietnam would kind of look into that um so I'll start off with kind of how Vietnam would look into it so Vietnam looks into it as it is something that's there they understand it they know that it's umthe people that use it right so buying and selling is okay. everything else which you see is is uh exactly what they say so anything that's received right is illegal, right? so it's the same thing like any other country you can't go intosay Thailand and say I'm going to go buy something with US Dollars it's exactly the same thing right but if you use it as a method offor what we do in new Trump a is like we'll go and say you're taking Neutron pay is a method but at the end, receiver is always going to receive that currency, so in this case Vietnam would receive that currencyall right so that usually helps us regulators and say. It's okay with themuh from this standpoint but it is still kind of being examined right so they still look at itand they say we want to figure out how it actually works how we're going to get a perfect framework around it so kind of if you look at it there's other Frameworks are around southeast Asia so you can look at like Japan South Korea, Japan being a very good kind of indicator because they they werein the industry for a while um and that's kind of how then I'm kind of looks at it in a way right from from my perspective of who we've talked with um and it kind of framing it a little bit more into How the West kind of takes it because I'm from Canada is Canada is really structured right so we have compliance and Frameworks of how digital assets come into kind of Fear or traditional um is that it's all the same they look at it as it's it's Finance right so if you're transacting withBitcoin or anything like that they look at it as it's the same thing as you would comply with like AML and kyc processes right so as long as you follow that that follows the same kind of framework and then that will eventually kind of mold into how ฆoutheast Asia does it I believethey don't want to look at it as something extraI  believe what what we've seen is that they want to do it asAmendmentright because if you're creating a whole bunch of new Frameworks and policies that don't apply to chat fee which is what we do every day it's just kind of a complete waste of timeso that's that's kind of what I've seen so far is that they they want to kind of amend into what is what we have existing and then kind of roll up uhwhat we can do with Bitcoin and digital assets Thank you very much since you mentioned Japan that this Mrs in Japan has been developed quite substantially  in the past years and can I ask um cultural song in order to share your experience in dealing with The Regulators government authorities who initially they might not have full understanding about what Bitcoin is. Yeah so my experience dealing with uh the Japanese Regulators I'm based in Japan and I have Bitcoin company there back in 2019 2020 I launched a experimental uh non-30 lightning based auction platform and so the Baseline that you need to understand about Japanese regulation is mount gox so Mount Cox happened back in 2014 Mount Cox was uh based in Tokyo and thatwas probably the initial spark that with the fire and the regulators and they decided to come in and so Japanese regulation is very heavily focused on protecting uhuh custody usersl so exchanges for examplecustody user funds and the main thing uh the Japanese Regulators are interested in protectthing is is from is uhH hacks on custodians and from umbad custodians basically like STX for example uhlast year Japanese regulations were successful in protecting Japanese FDX users so interestingly enough that approach Works howeverI believe that while we should be striving for a non-custodial uses and usage of Bitcoin and these evacuationskind of nudgedevelopers towards that direction it it's also true that non-custodial Bitcoin wallets and servicestend to havea little more uh unfamiliar user experience for new users usersso uh 1 thing that I wish that Japanese Regulators would allow some kind of exemption for smaller scale custodians, so that you can have things like tip Bots oryou knowvery small but uh tangible experiences that get people's first step into Bitcoin umyeah that's something that's very difficult to do with Japanese uh regulations focused on custody right nowwell once you mentioned about the um um small custodian can you elaborate that term a little bit further I mean what kind ofwhat kind of amount is small medium and large of course so because of Japan'sexperienced with Mount gox and then after that even in 2018 there were several hacks at Japanesechangesumthe custody was are actuallycombined with exchange regulations so even if you're not providing services to users where they can buy ortell Bitcoinuh you still need the same exact license that a uh exchange like a bigchange with need and it costsanywhere between 500000 US dollars to a million US dollars a yearuh paperwork and compliance costto maintain that licenseso it's not feasible for small-scale custodians to uh comply with theseregulation so I would say it's of course very difficult to uh draw a queer winewhere you knowthis is the linea custodian should be exempt and this is the line where they should comply with regulations but uhhopeful that eventually they would uhcarve out some kind of exemption foruh you knowlet's say something like twenty dollars per user is fine or 100 dollars per user is finelike thatwonderful thank you I'll come back a bit later on um on another topic well let's move come closerfrom Canada to Japan and now to um Southeast Asian country can I ask you experience Dominic I mean you are German of coursebut you based in a Vietnam for a decade already can you share with us I mean would be wonderful if you can compareto economies as far as regulations upon Bitcoin is concernedDominic placeyeah so I think like with the location of our business um we have made already a choicea choice like which regulations we prefer basicallyso like in Germany everything is like you see it generally in the economy it's not a veryfriendly place for entrepreneurshipa lot of the big companies we talked about it before in Germany if you just look at the stock market index it's like all these companiesdedicates all there's nothing really new coming upand I was also early involved in the Bitcoin Community is over there likeGermany I thinknowadays again has 1 of the strongest Bitcoin communities in Europeback from the potential from the the people you have theirbut they can't execute in Germanyso they all end up leaving or they give up and go back to their corporate jobs they can't execute their ideas in Germanyregulation I mean we have they're pretty strict even though you have the biggest Market as far as Bitcoin is concerned in Europeyeah it sounds quite contradictory can you elaborate that furtherand in Germany it's extremely protective of likethe old industry and the old money so they just don't want the upsets coming upthere so even if you have like a lot of potential and a lot of smart people also likebefore Bitcoin if you just talk about the internet in generalhow awesome have people in Germany where are the internet companies from Germanynot there the people left to the US for example where they actuallycan build their businessand nowadays of course um like with us and also like orbit is increasingly moving over to Asiafocus is likeHR is more like the golden place to go to for entrepreneurshipand how about Vietnamum because if you decided to come to Vietnam that's mean there is something attractive hereregulations is not as strict as in Germany or opportunity or what is itdifferent with the regulations in Vietnam I mean we have been engaging The Regulators they also to close to 10 years now since 2014um it's all about that I mean they are not in a hurry really to implement any regulations andVietnam is like a country which iscompared to like a lot of Western countriesthere's still like a Primacy ofthe politics of like the government there was like a Western countries where the government often just likeexecute whatthe big money basically wantsumwhich also means like Vietnam has different objectives there so they are not necessarily trying to protect likethe big Corporation in the first place they're trying to protect the power of the government and then they look at you and look likeokay are these guysbeneficial for for us basically or are they a threat to usand depending on this they are looking how they basically engage with the people regulation wise Vietnam right now is orbit hasthatnot much in place besides like protecting umthe the currency there for like the payment spot but it doesn't mean that people can run completely wired there I mean like if there's like any of these large scams going onand the government see this is like a potential for like social unrest whatever it makes bad headlines make the government lookthen they will crack down on itso they will find ways basicallycome after you if you do a lot of bad stuff which you don't likewonderful okay I come back um to um in a later round MayI mean now we come back to Thailandum can you share your experience dealing with and government authorities The Regulators The Hosttoum Bitcoin as a means of um payments can you share your experience probably withI'm paying